Search By Tags

10 Stupid Questions (6th wise interviewee) 創作人/編舞/舞者 伍宇烈

一、你覺得 dance 同 sex 兩者有咩關係呀?

四、你聽過最 romantic 嘅說話係乜嘢呀?

七、你覺得自殺,喺道德上係咪錯呀?

and... 十個 Yuri 想問我有關舞蹈嘅問題

我寫第一個舞評,係因為睇到一個演出,心裡面第一次有一種 urgency,想記低一個 live performance。如果我要多謝一個人,嗰個人會係 Yuri (伍宇烈) 。我第一篇舞評係寫佢創作嘅《硬銷》(2008) ,喺 Muse Magazine 刊登。

「Subvert」(顛覆)、「defies easy definition」(違抗容易的定義)、「transgression」(越軌) 同「questions」(質疑),呢幾個字喺嗰篇舞評出現過。而呢幾個字,其實都可以喺評論佢其他創作嘅時候用得着。比起其他本地舞蹈作品,我喺 Yuri 嘅 work,睇到更多嘢。作為創作者,Yuri 好反叛,所以佢嘅作品通常都好好睇。我又會見到佢對某啲經典、文化同人事物嘅情懷同質疑。

不過,同佢傾偈,有時會覺得自己唔算好了解佢,因為佢有一套屬於佢自己嘅思考邏輯。慢慢發現,佢嘅胡思亂想、離經畔道,係來自佢嘅 openness。喺佢嘅世界裡面,無絕對嘅好,或者無好。所以,佢要不斷問:「點解唔得?」

一、你覺得 dance 同 sex 兩者有咩關係呀?

[想了十秒] 都係用身體,或者同個身體有關。Sex 係一種你好 believe 當下 moment 嘅enjoyment。Dance 肯定係。只不過[用嘅] body parts… 其實有陣時甚至[用嘅] body parts 都無乜關係。所以呢兩個原因[令]我覺得佢哋應該好密切。點解有啲人覺得,賣弄個身體就係色情,就唔得?點解啲人以前唔畀人跳舞就係咁解囉。嗰樣嘢係… [跳舞] expose 咗一[啲]好 personal 嘅嘢嚟㗎。同埋… 好 vulnerable。

有啲人覺得 [having] sex 同 [making] love 可以係好無關係── making love 同 sex 係兩回事。Sex 可以係好 technical。咁 so is dance。Dance 啲人咪又係揈手揈腳,嘩好似好勁好勁 (好technical)。咁佢係咪好 physical 吖?係呀。咁但係如果你 consider 嗰[啲動作]係 dance,咁 sex 咪等於係 dance [咁 technical] 囉。咁如果你話 making love 係有唔同,咁 you tell me what’s the difference between [making] love and having sex。咁即係 dance 同 [mechanical] movement 嘅分別。

二、假設你有個仔,你會唔會畀佢好細個就學芭蕾舞呀?

「畀佢」呀?嗱我諗個重點係「會唔會畀佢」,唔係學芭蕾舞。[…] 咁如果你話「我畀佢」,即係我有唔畀佢嘅時候囉,即係我係 making a choice 囉。咁我諗 [係講緊]我想唔想 [幫別人去] make 呢個 choice。呢個「別人」 happens to be 係我個仔啫。咁我係咪就要控制我個仔,等於我要唔要控制我嘅 students,等於我要唔要控制我嘅父母,當佢[哋]老嘅時候。當佢[哋] 唔可以再 make choices 嘅時候,我點樣可以幫佢哋 make choices,我哋係咪 assume 佢哋唔可以再 make choices。[稍停] 咁但係我會 encourage 每一個人、每一個小朋友 […] 當佢未接觸過呢樣嘢嘅時候,我會 encourage 佢:take a look,have a go,try it。咁好嘞,呢個之後嘅重點就係:when?And where?And how?畀佢去 taste 呢一樣嘢。你介紹朋友去睇一個 show,其實就係,你想話畀佢聽:this is something interesting but there is no guarantee。你想同佢 share 一啲你 feel satisfied、feel happy、feel proud、feel emotional 嘅嘢,你想同一個你 care 嘅人去 share 吖嘛。[…] 咁但係 no guarantee 㗎嘛。唔係話[你]接觸跳舞,你一定會鍾意,或者你一定要成功添。所以呢啲全部都係一個 sharing 嚟嘅,所以 [唔係] obligation。我唔覺得我要 make 呢個 decision for [我個仔] 。

三、你做過最大膽嘅嘢係咩呀?

[仍吃着柚子] 大膽── 係咪 in retrospect 㗎?Er… 係吖。即係當時覺得無乜嘢,但係後來覺得「wow,I did that?!」嗰種呀? [係咪 in retrospect]都得。都幾得意㗎,因為呢個係一種個人嘅價值、嘅睇法。係呀,係呀。

「大膽」通常都[被人]覺得係同 risk 有關,咁但係如果當下嗰陣時,make 咗呢個 decision,咁係咪 take 咗個 risk 呢?咁有無 consciousness take 咗個 risk 呢?[靜默約十秒] 可能我嘅 first sexual experience 可能係一個好大膽嘅嘢。係當時覺得,定話係而家諗返呀?而家諗返。[咀嚼着柚子] 因為係個 stranger 嚟㗎。講唔講得係幾時㗎?好多年前,我喺英國讀書嘅時候 […] 中學 […] 16 歲。即係一個 impulse 想同呢個 stranger … Pickup 㗎。[…] 喺個 market 嗰度。嗰樣嘢係… 我諗十幾歲嘅時候,你又完全無 [呢種經驗],但係你又知道有種叫做「urge」… 好似呢個人 […] somehow 又好似 anticipate 到,去 lead to something like sex 嗰樣嘢。好 mysterious 㗎嘛。嗰樣嘢[我] allow it to happen。[…] 而家諗返起真係幾大膽,因為無 protection,又無 knowledge […] 你完全無嗰種 「我知道 what I am doing」[…] 我無事咪好彩囉。[…] 咁但係你 take 咗任何 risk 嘅時候,有時,係咪應該顧慮咁多呢,呢啲嘢?你嗰陣時驚唔驚呀?[肯定] 唔驚!

四、你聽過最 romantic 嘅說話係乜嘢呀?

[想了一會] 點解我唔記得嘅?[…] 我[記得]自己講[過]咩[畀人哋聽]。我覺得都好浪漫㗎:「我可以望住你,咁樣望住你,望住一世呀」。我覺得好浪漫。

即係嗰一下,浪漫唔係長久嘅,浪漫係真係一個 split second [嘅諗法]嚟㗎咋。[…] 你信,而你又講得出口。我覺得都好浪漫。點解我唔記得人哋[講過嘅浪漫說話] 呢?[兩秒後] 吖!Something in the same vein。我記得呢句說話:「我可以拖住你隻手,拖到天光呀」[…] 因為嗰個「聽朝」呢,係好似「一世」咁樣。甚至你無諗過... 聽朝嚟唔嚟都好,無所謂。好浪漫呀呵?同埋嗰樣嘢喺中文裡面,可以係誇張㗎嘛,即係「我拖到你聽朝」,嗰樣嘢唔係真係 literally 聽朝[,係唔知幾時嘅未來]… 無錯。聽落係㗎。同埋因為你[當時]坐喺度同[嗰個人]咁好傾… 黑麻麻半夜三更,你覺得「到聽朝」,已經覺得可以係好… [強調] 永恆呀![…] 唔係佢 promise 你任何嘢。嗰句說話… [突然] 呀!係好似我哋掌握咗時間一樣。[…] 當你可以掌握時間,你諗吓嗰樣咗嘢係可以幾咁大,幾咁遠,同埋無限。[…] 就算我哋幾 jaded 都好,有一啲 moment 你係覺得可以 last forever。

五、通常喺咩情況下,你會講大話呀?

[撕開柚子,一邊吃着] 講大話呀?[認真] 我唔係好講大話㗎喎。[…] 其實講大話嘅人呢,未必係真係講大話,因為只係聽嗰個人先可以做呢個 judgment。[…] 我講得出嗰樣嘢,梗係 believe 佢係真,我先講啦。但係 intentionally 佢想呃你呢?嗱「佢」 吖嘛,你都講「佢」 吖嘛,咁係你 judge 緊佢所講嘅嘢係咪想呃你,係你嘅 disbelief 令到嗰番說話係咪大話咋嘛。唔。我要講個大話畀你聽嘅時候,我梗係當佢係真啦,點會叫做「大話」呢?[…] 你唔信嘅時候,你會 categorise 佢 as 大話。咁當然 stupid 啲人,[佢] 連自己都唔信嘅時候,[佢] 咪緊講個大話畀你聽囉,咁呢個好 stupid 㗎嘛。[…] 如果用呢個方法去諗,當自己呃自己嘅時候又點呀?話明叫「呃自己」,梗係信我先講得出口吖嘛!即係都係[相]信嚟嘅? Of course!

你講過,你覺得最大嘅- [突然理直氣壯] 所有 ballet performance 都係一個大話嚟嘅。你行到出去… [配合手勢] 「Ah,the king and the queen…」 嗰啲全部都係大話。嗰啲好虛偽嘅,嗱,「虛偽」呢個[詞]唔係貶義嚟嘅。你係 put up 一樣嘢畀人哋[睇] ,話畀人聽,呢個就係個 king 同個 queen。「Oh,you are so beautiful tonight…」,當下你信㗎嘛,但係 at the same time 你又知,因為你好 conscious,嗰樣嘢唔係真㗎嘛。[…] 都係一個大話。但係個 beauty 亦都係在於呢個大話── 佢係謊言嚟㗎。[繼續撕開柚子] 啊好衰,實畀人抦呀,我咁樣答完之後。唔好理,答咗先。梗係唔理啦。*

* 呢個訪問本來係諗住喺本地一本舞蹈刊物發表先,但係最終都無。

六、你自己 favourite body part 係邊度?

我唔會咁樣答你:「我個腦」,或者「我個心」。又唔會咁 vulgar 話係我嘅 penis。又唔會話畀你聽係:我[對]眼。[…] 頭髮 […] 嗰樣嘢唔係我,剪出嚟嘅。Hmm… favourite?無 favourite。我諗有啲人 assume 我鍾意自己[對]腳,喺好多人眼中我[對]腳好靚,但係如果我都認同佢[哋],就有少少… 自大。咁我又唔會咁講。如果話我條腰… 應該話我嘗試喜歡我自己條腰,有咁粗。我嘗試去接受我自己呢個 age。[…] 我希望嘗試[令]佢 become my favourite part— my thickening waist。

七、你覺得自殺,喺道德上係咪錯呀?

唔係。點解唔係?可以 in control of 一樣咁重要嘅,我覺得 morally 唔係 incorrect。即係我係咪要[變成] vegetarian,係我嘅身體吖嘛,我想食[素] 吖嘛,我又唔害到你。我食菜,我又唔係喺你個碟度攞啲菜嚟食添。咁,點會係 morally wrong 呢?[自殺]我會 upset people,因為佢[哋]唔捨得我。或者我[未]完成我嘅責任,會激嬲一啲人。That’s another issue。因為我唔覺得我哋活喺世上[係]為別人,就算嗰個係父母。我哋可以覺得要感激佢[哋],我哋可以覺得唔好意思,當你自殺,[會]影響身邊嘅人。但係呢啲全部都係,你認為人哋會咁樣睇你,所以先至[選擇係咪]做呢個 decision。咁,咪即係等於我而家着咩衫係為人哋着囉,即係我而家梳個咩頭都[係]為你去做。[自殺]唔係 wrong,佢唔係完全錯嘅。

八、邊一種動物最能夠代表你呀?

[撕着柚子] 動物?[稍停] 而家呀?其實我從來都唔覺得動物可以代表我。因為我答問題都可以好直接,唔駛借一個動物[比喻]嘅。[Winnie 笑] 因為你實問點解㗎嘛。

但係一定要咁樣問,一定要咁樣答嘅話呢… 可能係一隻曱甴。幾 survive 到嘅,我覺得自己。我覺得嗰種… mutate (變種) 咗去一啲嘢。我可以因為呢啲環境而去 mutate,我覺得幾得意。[…] 我又好得意㗎喎,我會打啲曱甴。你會打死佢呀?咁呢啲係咪 out of jealousy 呀?

九、你人生以來最 embarrassing 嘅 situation 係乜?

Embarrassing?有一兩個 incidents come to mind… 但係最 embarrassing 嘅 situation 呀?[稍停] 「Embarrassing」係咪同我自己點樣睇自己有關係,即係好 insecure… 我諗 35 歲以前,都好 embarrassing 個人生,即係… 好似啲嘢全部都係…好… 好怯[咁]去做任何嘢。即係都好緊張人哋點樣睇自己── 成個人生都係。我諗唔[係] 35 歲添呀,我諗 40 歲前… 呢幾年好似好啲。

十、你最想問你自己嘅一個問題── 可以係自己答唔到,或者唔知道點答嘅問題。

你想活到幾時?「想」呀?你呢一個問題 imply 咗你可以… consciously 咁樣end… 佢 imply 幾樣嘢嘅。第一,係啦,你話可以 imply [我可以選擇] 點樣 end。同埋我應該點掌握我而家有限嘅時間。即係當得佢有限,你當得佢差唔多明天就要無嘅。[…] 當得一年時間,我就好好 finish 我應承咗人做嘅嘢,或者… 重有十年,我係點樣 plan 我十年,等到我身邊嘅人都… 更加可以相聚呢?所以 imply 咗對時間嘅一種嘅無奈。因為真係唔知吖嘛,咁你好似無時無刻都要在準備中。咁我覺得嗰樣嘢,我係 pretty much at peace with it 嘅。

「活在當下… 活在當下…」嗰幾個字呢,唔知點解有幾日呢,我就好似明白:哦原來係咁解㗎。咁我可以放開一啲… 一啲心情囉。咁我就可以好好地咁生活… 啩。

我諗我唔應該再問 Yuri 多十題問題,佢喺被問嘅時候已經不斷反問我問嘅問題,我心裡面其實好想笑,但係忍住。佢個人就係咁。不過,其實如果佢唔係認真,都唔會有心機質疑啲問題。咁不如等佢問返我。

十個 Yuri 想問我 (作為觀眾) 有關舞蹈嘅問題

一、點解觀眾會覺得明[一個舞蹈演出]係咁重要呢?我唔係 assume 所有人都想明,但係點解我哋成日聽到有人話:「我唔明一個 ballet」,或者「我唔明一個 dance」,就 stop there 㗎呢?即係唔明好似係一個 description,或者係一個 reflection of what you just saw:「我唔明喎」。

二、喺香港你想睇到啲乜嘢嘅舞蹈呀?

三、你覺得而家後生嘅創作人,佢最需要啲咩嘢?

四、你覺得古典芭蕾舞嘅存在價值喺香港係咩呢?

五、你覺得[香港城市當代舞蹈團藝術總監]曹誠淵點呀?

六、如果,Winnie,[你最愛嘅人]話想你同佢跳隻舞,你會點樣準備自己?

七、你會點做一隻[代表]香港[嘅]舞蹈?

八、香港嘅芭蕾舞可以係點?

九、你可唔可以 define ‘what is dance’──尤其是當嗰樣嘢人人都認為佢唔係 dance?

十、人死咗,會唔會跳舞㗎?因為答案太長,之後再發表。

first published on muse blog on 9 aug 2013

http://www.musemag.hk/textpattern/winniechau/83/10-stupid-questions-for-6th-wise-interviewee

the unspoken

© 2020 by winnie chau